‘War vets entitled to their opinion’

Source: ‘War vets entitled to their opinion’ | The Herald January 21, 2017

Zanu-pf National Political Commissar, Cde Saviour Kasukuwere (SK), has been accused of abusing his position for factional ends, and has been accused of being unfit for the lofty office of national political commissar. Our Political Editor Tichaona Zindoga (TZ) caught up with Cde Kasukuwere to talk about this and other issues. The following are excerpts from the interview.TZ: First of all, Cde Minister, questions have emerged over the status of Zanu-PF provincial chairmen, most of whom are said to be in an acting capacity and were allegedly imposed by yourself. What is the position regarding those?
SK: I am not answering those. Ask something else. Let’s talk about substantive issues. You guys are creating a furore over nothing. You know what the constitution of the party says. If there is a vacancy in the party, the executive shall co-opt, right? So do you hold a conference, do you hold an election every time there is a vacancy in a province?

If in any organ of the party or any structure of the party there is a vacancy, it’s spelt out in the constitution that they shall co-opt. So when we dismissed the chairmen at the time of Gamatox, what did we do? All of the provinces co-opted. Did we have to go for new elections? Because what it would have meant was that we were going to throw away the entire province. Because it can’t just be the chairman it would be the whole thing. That’s not how it is done.

TZ: Perhaps, connected to that, questions have been raised over the meeting you held last week with provincial chairmen, disputing in particular the communique issued at the end. Can you just explain to us what really transpired?
SK: The meeting was held as a normal meeting that we hold, myself as a political commissar and the chairpersons where we coordinate the work of the party. But what emerged at that meeting was the conduct of one (Energy) Mutodi who had just a day before or a few days before made a statement in the press, to the effect that the President of this country must go.

Secondly, he called for an extraordinary conference under which Zanu-PF must choose a successor. This call by Mutodi is not just one, but there have been similar renegade voices that came or were making such noises. People who were either suspended or expelled from the party, who were saying to the party the President must go and the party chairpersons reaffirmed their commitment and that they stand 100 percent behind President Mugabe.

That is our party line and that is what was agreed at the conference in Masvingo. That is what was agreed in 2014 at the National Congress, that our candidate come 2018 will be President Mugabe. In other words, the call by Mutodi, was out of place and mischievous, unheard of and unbecoming and they did the right thing to defend the party position, what was agreed to by the party membership.

We just can’t wake up in the morning and listen to one crazy character who has whatever he thinks he must say about the party and expect us to be guided by that.

TZ: But why do you concern yourself with a character like Mutodi who is not even within the structures?
SK: But you saw the company he hangs out with; how big it is. You might say to me why should we be concerned? I think you understand why we are concerned.

TZ: You can explain further.
SK: I told you, just look at the company that he hangs out with how big it is. We can`t just keep quiet as a party, why should we? We want and that`s why the statement made it clear that the leadership of our party has to be guided by what has been agreed to.

We can’t become on our own careless and dangerous about what we do. There is party position. President Mugabe is our President, he was elected in 2013 and he has his duty to serve the people of this country. Any destabilisation, any attempt to remove the President, we take it very seriously.

Any noises that point to a kind of organised noise that are aimed at trying to affect the leadership of the President, we get concerned. The party just can`t sit akimbo. You are derailing us from proceeding with Zim-Asset, from doing what the President was supposed to do and is supposed to do and what we are supposed to be doing right now.

TZ: Speaking of characters like Mutodi, you have been seen hanging around with the likes of Temba Mliswa, who has also badmouthed the President, does that not amount to the same thing?
SK: Temba Mliswa is a Member of Parliament and I am a Minister of Government. If Temba Mliswa comes, he doesn’t come to my house, he comes to the office, he came to my office. When I met him, I made a full disclosure to the nation. I initiated the process of capturing him in the office and saying, he has come to meet me. It was not some midnight call that one cannot explain.

TZ: How do you respond to the allegations that as commissar you have been preoccupying yourself with chasing people away from the party rather than uniting and building structures?
SK: Quite to the contrary, this commissar has ensured that the party has discipline and direction. I do not chase away anybody, that is not my duty. That duty belongs to the National Disciplinary Committee. Now we have another second layer which reviews the disciplinary decisions.

When people behave in a manner that is unacceptable in the party, they don’t get fired by Saviour Kasukuwere; it is the party machinery. It is all of the leaders in Politburo, Central Committee; Central Committee actually endorses the decision.

So, who have I fired at a personal level? There is no way I can behave in that manner as if there is no leadership above me. There are leaders, there are structures. Provinces will complain if people are out of line.

There is a National Disciplinary Committee set up in terms of the constitution which has other members. In this case now it is chaired by (Legal Affairs Secretry) Cde (Patrick)Chinamasa, last time it was chaired by Vice President Mphoko.

Members were Cde Chinamasa, Cde (Kembo) Mohadi, Cde (Pupurai) Togarepi, Cde Sandi Moyo from the Women’s League and myself. So if you say, I as one person will sack members from the party, I think that is being unfair and you are trying to give me the authority that I do not have. After a decision has been made in the National Disciplinary Committee it is taken to the Politburo, it is debated extensively.

When (former Vice President Joice)Mujuru was fired, how come you didn’t ask me about firing Mujuru? You think I would have fired Mujuru myself? All the people who have been fired from the party, Didymus Mutasa, etc, you think they were fired by Saviour Kasukuwere? We take a collective decision, it is cowards who will turn around and say it’s Kasukuwere who has done it.

Anyone who says that is not serious because this is a party that makes decisions. If people transgress, and go against the party, the party will have to take measures against them.

TZ: One of the major issues in the public domain is that you belong to the so-called G40 faction along with the likes of Professor Jonathan Moyo, with not only the intent of scuttling the ascendency of Vice President Mnangagwa but also to show power on yourself. What is your comment on that?
SK: I am surprised that you are already talking of the ascendency which is a Herald line. I don’t know where that is coming from.

TZ: Even the private media say that . . .
SK: I thought you would know better, that there is a way in which the succession in the party is handled. The constitution of our party stipulates how any transfer of power is handled in the party. If the President is to retire today, there is a process which is aptly captured in the constitution of the party.

So it is not one which is forced upon us by individuals or the media, it is constitutional process captured in the party constitution. Now this G40 whatever it means, I have been on record to say there is no such thing as G40.

Professor Moyo has been able to explain that he wrote a paper a long time ago where he spoke about the role of young people in the ongoing process of development and so forth. It was to do with empowerment and so forth.

To then change that and say there is grouping, if anybody has a grouping they must identify themselves and their grouping and not give some of us as a grouping. I have no grouping. I do not hold any secret meetings with anybody; I don’t have time for that. I am the party’s political commissar and my duty is simple, keeping discipline in the party and keeping people focused on the politics of the day.

TZ: How do you respond to concerns that despite President Mugabe repeatedly warning against discussing party issues on social media or in the private media, you and others have been granting interviews to the private media and even heard saying that you will not grant interviews to the public media?
SK: How can you say that, you are right in front of me and I am granting you an interview. Can’t you see that you are contradicting yourself completely? You are talking to me, I called you and you are saying you have heard.

My appeal to you at Herald House is grow up and focus the nation on things that make a difference. We have to attend to the economy, employment creation, to get the party stronger and united moving forward. That is what we must look at. The rains are upon us, we have had a good rainy season so far, the Government has supported the Presidential Inputs Scheme, Command Agriculture. The Chinese have supported the Presidential Inputs Scheme with fertilisers.

Go around the country, look at the success stories, tobacco story, cotton story. We are now going to produce over 200 000 tonnes of cotton. These are the stories. What do we do about housing? What do we do about SMEs?

These are issues we expect you to be looking at.

TZ: And the first part of my question relates to discussing party issues in the private media and social media.
SK: You have asked for an interview; I will give you. If the private media were to ask me here and have asked me a question, I will answer them. If you think it is very important for you to be given interviews by Government, and by Government I suppose all of us as ministers, then do the right thing, behave properly.

You have been very reckless. Each time you write about individuals it’s as if you own the country and it’s as if the paper belongs to an individual. That is a taxpayers’ paper. It belongs to all of us and your right to express your views, fine and fair, but remember you have got a responsibility.

Social media, you see you must ask those who are on social media, who express themselves through social media, why they express themselves through social media. I have my own social media and I do tweet now and again when I feel there is something I must say because it’s my right, that’s why Twitter is there. But I do not go beyond what I think is the official party line and the position of the State.

I think every individual understands how they must communicate. We use the media to promote the party and at times to defend when scoundrels become careless.

TZ: It looks like there has been bad blood between yourself and war veterans. Do you have a problem with individuals or the war veterans as a constituency?
SK: I have no problems with the war veterans’ constituency, no problems. And I think those individuals who have problems with me, they let them say so. I have no problems with anybody, I have not responded to anybody who has said whatever they have said. I have kept my mouth shut.

TZ: But you once described them as drunkards.
SK: I described an individual. I said, Matemadanda’s statement which he made from the Rainbow Towers, I am sure he was drinking and he made that statement from the Rainbow Towers. Surely, I have not attacked war veterans.

When you twist it to make Matemadanda to the embodiment of all war veterans you are being unfair. I don’t think the war veterans accept what Matemadanda is doing. If anything, I think that’s why he’s been kicked out of the party because his behaviour is unbecoming.

TZ: Some within that constituency of war veterans have been saying you do not deserve the position of commissar; it needs someone who went to war. What would be your thoughts on that?
SK: Who am I to fight their personal views, those are their personal views.

TZ: Lastly, ahead of the 2018 elections, do you see yourself as commissar working harmoniously with war veterans and really taking in cadres who are willing to work for the party even if they have been subject to disciplinary action?
SK: The party has taken disciplinary action before, it is the conduct of those cadres who have been disciplined that determines whether the party will have them back or not. Let me give an example. Professor Moyo was once disciplined by the party, expelled from the party, conducted himself in a manner that the party saw fit to readmit him.

You recall he stood as an independent but when he came to Parliament and in his interactions with the party membership, it was seen fit that his suspension, his expulsion be lifted. Cde Jabulani Sibanda before and he was brought back into the party.

There are many cadres who have been disciplined. It is part and parcel of any revolutionary process. You will be disciplined. It is your conduct during and after the disciplinary hearings and what you do that will determine how the party will treat you going forward.

So was we go into 2018, we are more than ready and I think the party’s position, His Excellency has always said, we will continue to review the cases of cadres who have been disciplined at each and every Politburo meeting. Their reviews and their appeals.

Just now a number of cadres have been reinstated in the party, those who had suspensions up to the end of December 31. Hundreds of them have come back into the party because their disciplinary terms have expired and they are back in the party. This is how the party works.

Even if you have been disciplined and you are a party cadre, you continue to work for the party, you continue to support the party. But once some have been disciplined they take it personally, they attack leaders left right and centre, they hold press conferences almost daily. That makes it difficult to embrace those people back into the party because they would have taken positions that make it difficult for anyone to look at them in a positive manner.

So we think as we go into 2018, Zanu-PF is strong, Zanu-PF is winning the elections and Zanu-PF will win 2018.